Transcribed by https://otter.ai

David Harvey  0:01 
Welcome to the two texts podcast. I'm your host, David Harvey, and I'm here with my co host, John Andrews. In this podcast, we're two friends in two different countries here every two weeks talking about two different texts from the Bible. This is our launch series, however, so we're bringing you a daily episode of the two of us talking about the parables of Jesus. This is Episode Four. And it's called flash parables, part two.

John Andrews   0:31 
So let's read these beautiful parables about the treasure and the pearl. So you get the kingdom of heaven is like treasure, hidden, innovated. same word, as we've already discovered there. And the context of that this is verse 44. When a man find it, he hid it again. And then in his joy went and sold all he had and bought the field know, when when we just read that on its own, it's not making sense. But remember the trajectory, we've just gone on this idea of the yeast that is hidden. Then the fact that from Psalm 78, Jesus is ordering the hidden things, the misunderstood things, and revealing them. And then to wrap that up, verses 4546. Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant looking for fine pearls when he found one of great value. He went away and sold everything he had and bought it. No, there's no direct reference to hiddenness within that parable, but the emphasis is phonus. He's seeking and he found it. And of course, again, our listeners might hear the nuance of Jesus's words in Matthew, if you seek cm word, as used here, in this parable, emergence seeking or looking for fine pearls, Jesus uses that word when he says, Seek and you will find, and the word phoned are again, is the CM idea. So you get this beautiful correlation. Something is hidden, in plain sight. Jesus is no as the new prophet auto renews hidden things and explaining them through the parables. So that once we get them and are no longer hidden, we share that treasure, we pass that treasure on to those and I think that's, that's that's the connectedness within the Matthew 13. Tax. I think when you once we see that, I think it all links together. And again, it, it stops us from vacuo amazing the statements, because there's often a flow of trajectory and thought, in the ministry of Jesus, I think that hidden This is a beautiful link. That helps us from Matthew 13, to Luke 13. Back to Matthew 13.

David Harvey  2:44 
And I love I love that john is it's just, it's, it's really, again, there's, there's a lot of stuff going on there even right down to teaching us how we should think about reading the Bible that we need to read it in, in bigger chunks here. Because they might be kind of tying things together. And, and so, so come come to this, then, you know, this idea of these two parables, then again, two sentences, you know, the kind of the kind of Jesus really maximizing the one sentence parable here. And I think people will find this as you explore the parables, how many of them are really short, you know, just single lines forming part of a bigger discourse, you know, which is kind of Jesus is just just nudging at you slowly but surely, you know, dropping all these year worms, but this idea of the kind of hide and seek duel here, you know, kingdom of heaven is like a treasure hidden in a field. And a man found it, you know, there's a little bit of, you know, we've got to think about this laterally at some point and trying to think about, like, what's actually going on here? And how is this? How is this actually going into this progression? iPhone saga is the first man even looking for it. You know, like, is he actually seeking or does he fall over it? You know, is he you know, you know, what, there's a lot of interesting things, but you almost get the sense the problem that he stumbles over it, you know, there's a lot of silence to fill in here. But, but a man found it and then, and I love that image of, of he finds it, and then decides, well, I need to make sure that this I get this. So he puts it back in the dirt covers it over. It's a bit like it's a bit Pirates of the Caribbean. But there's a bit that jumps out to me, john, that I'm seeing a theme in this in this chapter of Matthew. So there's a lot of seed gets scattered. If we go back, you know, to think about the parable of the sower. There's a lot of scouting See, to get scattered everywhere. Right. Now there's a lot of door and the yeast gets worked through all of it, right. And then there's a mustard seed that goes in a field and it kind of grows throughout the field. And now you have a man he finds a treasure suit. small enough to hide in a field. But interestingly in his joy, he doesn't go out and buy the corner of the field where he's hid the treasure. He doesn't go to someone go, Hey, listen, I want to buy that northwest corner of your field. Right? He buys the whole field of mud. For a treasure that we're trying to explain what the treasure is, all that we come away with is this man is a willing to, to hideously overpay right. So again, put it in modern terms, you know, you walk into a second hand car dealership, and it discovered that right in the middle of this car dealership, they happen to have rusting away in the corner, you know, James Dean's Ford Mustang from bullet. And so you realize, oh my goodness, this is a piece of an iconic, you know, Western film history. I've got to own this. And the owner doesn't even realize that he's got this car. there most of us what we know that how that story ends is you go and go, you got a rusty old Ford Mustang up there. Can I buy it off you but this parable says no, you go to the owner and go, I'm buying your whole dealership. Fight every car you've got in order to get that you get this sense of the holistic pneus of the kingdom that it's you know that we're all in,

John Andrews   6:14 
you know, again, we we have to be careful to argue for the silence that just tells us treasure amounts or size or, you know, this is after all a made up story by Jesus. But, but it is significant enough. So, and I concur with you, I think the inferences he stumbles over it. And I think there's a beautiful juxtaposition between the parable of the treasure and the parable of the pearls sitting beside each other because you've got somebody who stumbles and someone who's looking. So So you got this man, he's just gone about his world. And maybe in the in the, in the wider context of our conversation. He's in the crowd, and, and the SOAR is scattering this kingdom seed. And he goes, whoa, I didn't, I didn't expect to find that. And he looks at this young Rabbi on the hill and goes, I think that's the treasure. And so he goes home squares up and follows this month, so so I think you've got maybe maybe a picture, sideways picture, I love the sort of the car lock picture. You've got someone who turned up to hear this young Robbie speak and suddenly is whacked. He is full on his head, hits full on with this treasure. And he goes, Okay, we got to do something about this right now. So this treasure is so significant that a man is prepared to go liquidate everything he has to buy the field. Now that's the I think, I think that's got to grab, yeah, that's got to grab crow that's got a grabs me, I'm going, Wow. Okay, there's something going on here. And in the context of this treasure, that is worth everything to get it. And I think that's beautiful. And I think, I think that sense of the hiddenness of it, he stumbles across it. And, and Jesus is even suggesting to this crowd. Some of you're going to stumble over this thing. You can't even see it. No, but you're going to be on your way home, you're going to fall over this treasure, and it's going to change everything. And I think that's beautiful. And then I think the other parable relates to the fact that there are people in that crowd, and they are looking and Jesus knows they are they are look they have they've walked miles to hear him speak they haven't just turned up for like a free lunch in America. These people have been waiting for the kingdom of God. And we knew there are people like them because of the look and texted talks of honor the Prophet s and Simeon actually waiting for the kingdom to come. They've been waiting for this thing, whatever it looks like. And and this this merchant, I think represents a bunch of people of all shapes and sizes, religious or religious, whatever the label but they're looking they're looking they're looking in their eye at you know those two parables together David so encouraged me because I think again, I keep repeating this idea of Jesus confidence in the seed confidence in the kingdom. I just think you know, my goodness, there are people out there in planet non religious, that are going to be gone about your daily business and are gonna fall over this treasure. It's literally stumble over well. Never. What's that all about? And it will change their lives. And I also think there are millions of people, if not billions of people. And they're looking, they're looking for a pearl. And and in and in order to find that pearl of greatest price they may have have have to have opened a few dodgy oyster.

David Harvey  9:54 
Of course, oysters are not kosher. Yeah, oysters are not kosher, are they so again, you've got that At slight uncleanliness, sort of theme, oysters are not kosher. But here's where it might be hidden, you know, fields are muddy. And you know, and farming is not always the funnest of jobs, you know, yeast is unclean, but it's hidden in, it's hidden in the door,

John Andrews   10:19 
it points to the fact in terms of in terms of farming, like shellfish and stuff like that, which the Torah has a lot to say about. That, then the inferences. The person looking here may not be so again, you have you have just as you've had the juxtaposition in terms of the mark five stuff we've already talked about, you know, probably a Gentile delivered from demons, an outstanding Jewish man honored by the, by the synagogue, and, and then the woman unclean. You've got here, potentially, you know, a farmer, in the agricultural context of Galilee doing that, but then hold on, somebody is looking for pearls. On the fact that this is not, this is not going to end up on a Jewish dinner table. Means that either he's, he's, he's not searching, he's not farming for food, he's farming for pearls. And the other little implication may be that, again, Jesus nudges into a sort of a non Jewish searcher, which is an interesting little nuance if, if you're prepared to hang that up there.

David Harvey  11:35 
So I think there's definitely a sense that the merchant, the merchant isn't a well liked character in the ancient world, you know, they're a bit of you know, even in Shakespeare, you know, they're a bit of a they're a bit of a Shylock a bit of a, you know, a trickster. You don't you don't trust a merchant, in that sense, do you? And so, it's interesting. And in fact, there's actually a little piece in in Matthews Greek that I think is worth mentioning here. So I agree with you, john, I think that, again, it's another character, he's, you know, oysters are, you know, oysters are not kosher. So pearl hunting is a slightly, you know, off site industry, at the best of times, you know, you've got a merchant, slightly off site person, you know, in some services, but notice what the Greek does in this. So it says it says, again, Jesus told them what the kingdom of heaven was like, but the Greek reads, and I understand why the English translations smooth this out. The Greek reads a man, a merchant, was seeking for fine and I love By the way, the Greek word I just got to mention this for no point. Margarita is the Greek word. The Greek word for pearl is Margarita. Let our listeners can go and look up that connection in their own time. But, but but this H a man, a merchant, so so this is what the kingdom of heaven is, like a man, a merchant was seeking for fine pearls on finding one pearl of great value, he went and sold all that he had, and bought it. Well, I just, again, I'm just stretching into some nuance here. So don't bet your house on this or anything like that. But he's a man, a merchant, by the end of the parable, he's not a merchant anymore. Right? Because Because if he sells everything he has, so his cart, his horse, his his, his, you know, his his marketplace shack. You know, if all of that's gone, now his ability because because merchant literally the the Greek word and portal, which were, I think, where we get the term Emporium from which is a kind of go, but is literally a traveler. It's one who travels about to buy and sell trade. Well, if he basically liquidates all of that, he loses the ability to do this anymore. Now he's just a man with a pearl. He used to be a merchant looking for pearls. Now he's just a man with a pearl. And he has no mechanism. And again, I'm pushing into it. But I think that comes back to Matthews, really interesting wording, a man, a merchant, the king does the kingdom of God just scraped deeper into our identity, you know, that he we see him as a merchant, but he's actually he's a human right. And his anthropods is actually the Greek word. So a human, a merchant, that the kingdom of God scrapes away all of the uncleanliness all of the social stuff that we would burden on people and it's now just a person looking for something great. And which when in isn't that all of us at some level,

John Andrews   14:47 
absolutely beautiful. No, no, I love that. I love that. And again, I think that leans into the sort of layers of the text without taking into Reading into the text too much. I think there's there are layers within the support a nuance that goes while. That's that so. So here's, here's a sense of which a discovery literally changes the trajectory of a man's world, he's prepared to change his way of life, because of what he has discovered. And of course, you know, without reading too much into the parable before the man playing the field, when he I mean, could be, could be a laborer, part of that bigger estate. And, and so one who is maybe a peasant, living in subsistence culture, and some high, he know, becomes a land owner, he becomes someone who owns this thing, because of what he has found his motivation. And in many ways, both men their status changes, because of what they have discovered, it forces the change they cannot. So this is a beautiful idea, which I think you you've you've articulated magnificently, David, I think they cannot stay the same. Having discovered the treasure, right? So so it's back to our our little convos, you can't, once you've seen it, you have you know, struggled to unsee it, you've a that you've got to put that somewhere, you've either got to grab it, run with it, threw yourself into it, or you've got to find a file big enough to contain that thing and just put it in a box and put it away. But but here's to man not prepared to do that. They're not prepared to stuff the hidden back in the box, there actually, no, we got to have this. And under worlds, both are worlds, if we're prepared to follow the trajectory of the conversation in a slightly more literal way. Both are worlds then radically change, because of the treasure. Because of the pearl, they literally have to do a different way of living to make this work. And I think, I think that's the kingdom of God. So what is the kingdom of heaven like? Well, it's hard to describe. But when you bump into it, when you discover it, when you find it, you can't stay the same as it were, if you really see what we see, if you really discover the treasure that Jesus is now bringing out from the hiddenness. He's He's ordering the hidden things of the kingdom through these parables. Once you discover this, there's no going back. If we really grab it, and I i love that. And I think I think that makes sense of all that hidden revealed stuff. And that tension of you know, those that have more will be given those that don't have that will be taken away. You know, it's it's the idea of the Isaiah quilt, I think that helps square that circle, it fits all of that together, because because actually what Jesus is saying, in the context of the buried treasure, and the merchant, all these are people that got a bit and then grab more. All right, they, they didn't just settle he didn't just settle for the parole. He went right, I've got to have this. And so and they push further. And I think that's the that's the, the energy to beat to me that I mean, that literally gets my pulse up as I think I go well, that's, that's worth that's worth giving your life to.

David Harvey  18:43 
And it's interesting, isn't it? Because in one sense, as interpreters, you know, there's a caution in us and you feel I think, in both of us have grown, I kind of want to push this and say this about this story. But I've but I also realized I'm dealing with one sentence that gives me very little data, you know, but I think when you do it the way you've explained it there, you realize, well, of course that's what's going on in this story, because this is what happens. You know, this is this is what happens throughout Jesus's encounters with people people are, you know, you've got you know, Levi just gets up and walks away the early disciples just abandon their fishing businesses and they come and follow Jesus, you know, Peter says, we've lost everything to follow you, you know, Jesus is the the pearl is it and then you also get, you know, the rich young ruler who comes to Jesus and besides, no, I'm not willing to do that. That's not that's not in my kind of, you know, remit to be able to do that is so at some level, we see the kingdom of heaven work out exactly like this throughout the Gospels that actually this is quite a common story of the of the the spoken, yes, and leaving everything to follow. And then sometimes the unspoken,

John Andrews   19:54 
those who don't, when you follow down to the end of Matthew 13 Jesus, then He tells what feels like an out of step parable. So we've got, we've got the sort of the treasure in the pearl, and then the parable of the net and it's sort of things like a change of gear within that. And he concludes that parable by by, you know, it's almost a parable of judgment around that which is really quite profound. But then, but then he says this first 51 He says, Have you understood all these things? Jesus asked, and they go, yeah, you go, Yeah, really? Okay.

David Harvey  20:33 
I always when I read that passage, I feel like and I mean this for the deepest respect. Have you understood all this? I feel like it should read. Yes, they lied. It's the confidence where they go Yes, we've got it and you can like like you say, really?

John Andrews   20:52 
Absolutely. So so so so we just read on and we get past that humorous moment and verse 52, he said to them therefore every teacher of the law who has become a disciple of the kingdom of heaven is like what? an owner of a house no no look at that that so the two parables the pearl and the treasure move people from almost servant to owner right both of them become owners one becomes owner of the treasure in the field. The other one cup becomes one of the pearls right? So look at this. It's like the owner of a house. Look at this David, it's it's magnificent. Who brings out of his storeroom what new treasures as well as old boom, there we have Psalm 78. Connected he's it's back to this idea that what Jesus is doing to the parables is altering the hidden things. You're not new things. They're all things that have been misunderstood. But of course, in bringing them to his audience, there is new things in the old and he's exactly saying that he's bringing out of the store room, new treasures, see him word, as our lovely man who found his treasure in the deal, a treasures old and new alike and then as if the burst that bubble Devitt as if the burst up. So So here we are, we're lifted up into the higher and we're going all my goodness, Jesus has strung all these amazing pearls together in Matthew 13. forgive the pun, he has literally straw I mean, ideas are bouncing around and I was no hidden, phoned, you know, all of these gorgeous new answers, transformation and ownership. And then we're excited. And then verses 53 to 58 show you the paradoxical dynamic that Jesus has to deal with. Verse 53, when Jesus had finished these parables, he moved from there, coming to his hometown, he began to teach the people at the synagogue, and they were amazed. Where did he get this teaching? Verse 57. On they took offense at him. So we've just had all this amazing dialogue about treasure, hidden stuff, yeast, the psalm 78 connection. If you find the treasure, sale, your whole estate to get it, if you find that Pearl, boom, you have hit the jackpot, he goes home, and they took offense at him. It's just wow. I mean, it's just you think, Matthew, why? Why did you end this magnificent chapter on that? Because? Because that's exactly the paradox of the parables, it's, it's, there are people that are going to find treasure that will change your lives. And then there's got to be a bunch of people that will go, No. And they took offense at him. And Jesus actually says a prophet is not without honor, except in his own time, and in his own home. And tragically, verse 50, at the very last verse of Matthew 13. And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith. Oh, it's just that the paradox of Matthew 13 when you read it as a sweep, follow the trajectory, and then land on that you are, oh, my goodness, hi. Is it possible to miss this treasure? And yet, and yet, they did. So. To me it's a it's a magnificent piece of writing by Matthew, how he, how he puts those ideas together and ends has the courage to end a magnificent chapter on parables with treasure and pearls. flying everywhere with an Yeah, and here's the sad reality. Yeah, there's nothing

David Harvey  25:00 
It's, it's quite phenomenal the way the whole thing kind of wraps itself up. And it strikes me that this is what we're dealing with in terms of the ministry of Jesus, because I suppose this would be my kind of, you know, thought with both the parables in 44 and 45. What strikes me is interesting is that the treasure, or the pearl is present already, you know. So there's a tendency sometimes to think about the kingdom of heaven as something that's coming in the future, you know, so we'd read this sort of text and go, Oh, that's something that's going to happen some way from here. And there's a sense in which is it if you think that way, you're always looking ahead for when's it gonna happen? You know, and in these parables are going? No, it's already here. It's just, it's just unfortunately, it's over there and all that mud, or unfortunately, it's encased in gross oyster. And, you know, so the question is, you know, going back to your hiding and seeking metaphor, it's just, you're gonna have to start looking differently, you're gonna have to start seeing things differently, which I think is what's being wrestled with, you know, in all of the parables is this contrast this, this dis dash course, the way you think, isn't going to help you make sense of this. So if you think the kingdom of heaven and I think this is true for us today, as much as it was true for Jesus, original listeners, if you are constantly looking, going on when we all get there, you missed the fact that Jesus, you know, it's already here, it's already amongst you, and you're missing it if you're not careful. So, so you can literally take offense and reject Jesus, not because you're not because you're anti God, but because actually, you're expecting God to come in a different way. And you're not prepared to accept him in the way that he's actually come. So good.

John Andrews   26:57 
So not so good. So good. And I think if you connect the end of Matthew, and they took offense at him with treasure in a muddy field, and a pearl in a non kosher food, boom, I mean, you know, the yeast, the on unclean, this, the yeast, and I mean, it's, oh, I'm literally welling up with them. Or I'm struggling to not cry. Listening to that, because I, I go, Well, what else? Have we missed? David, do you know? Yes. Like, like, you know, as humans were given and our brokenness, we're so arrogant, aren't we like, like, I know, I'm speaking generally, I'm not speaking for everybody. But we're just, we're arrogant. And even even in fifth, we're arrogant. We think we know stuff. We think we've we've worked God out, we think we've worked the tech state. And then and then we discover treasure in the mud. And we go, hi, hi. Have I missed that? And I don't I never want to be on the wrong side of and they took offense at him. You know what I mean? And just because the Jesus that that I'm now being confronted with is like, in an oyster, or he's wrapped up in mud, or he's covered in yeast, I, I do want to go wide. But no, it's not. I want to have my heart open. It says, Lord, I never want to lose wonder, in the kingdom of God, I don't want to I don't want to get on the wrong side of that.

David Harvey  28:32 
And I like, you know, I was reading in my just devotional journey the other morning there that scene in Acts when Peters laying on the roof, and he has that vision of all these unclean animals coming down. And here's the Lord say, Take and eat. And you know, and pizza goes, No, I've never eaten anything unclean. And then there's that line, isn't there? You know, don't call unclean what the Lord is called clean. And you know, we might be okay with muddy fields, and leaven bread and oysters. But is there stuff we're calling unclean? And actually, the kingdom of God is hidden in that, you know, and you guys beautiful scene that follows where Peter has to turn up at Cornelius, his house, and you can see Peters out of his debt. Like, this is not what I'm trained for. You know, and yet God, the Holy Spirit works through that situation, almost echoing this parable that, you know, that there are treasures, you know, in fields. And so for us as a kind of modern listener. It's like, there's a superiority that could come and go, Oh, yeah, come on. Peter. Get on board. Bacon sandwiches are nice, you know? Well, it's easy for us to look at stuff we already think is clean, and assume that that's okay. But we have our own boundary lines where we go not i'm not sure I'm comfortable with God. Kingdom being there. And this parable group of parables seem to suggest well get calm. fribble quickly, because your offense might might lead you to miss what Jesus is doing.

John Andrews   30:05 
No, brilliant, there's a there's a magnificent scene in the magnificent series, called the chosen. I know, you've watched it. And I've watched, I've watched it a number of times, it's it's only got six episodes, and I have cried through every single one, every single one. And there's a magnificent scene where Matthew, the tax collector is called. And, and they depict Matthew brilliantly, I don't want to give it away. But if anyone's out there, and they haven't seen the chosen free app, you download it and watch the episodes for free. And you can make a donation if you want, but it's fun tastic it's really, really brilliantly written. And whoever has advised on the writing of that really has understood the spirit of what's going on around there. And so Jesus stops at Matthews booth, you know, Roman guard, locked behind his booth. And Jesus says, Matthew, come and follow me. And Peter steps in and Peter goes, Hey, what are you doing? Don't you know who this is? And And Jesus says, Yeah, of course. And and so, you know, he says, Well, you know, I called you that night. And Peter said, Peter said that, but this is different. You know, when he's calling the tax guy, but this is different. And Jesus turned to him and said, Matthew, or Peter get used to different, and I love, I love the the, I love the fact that all right, that's a very Western way of interpreting Jesus, but, but I love the fact that actually Jesus was constantly saying to his world, you need to get used to different you know, whether it's a healing of a woman in a synagogue on a Shabbat, or whether it's, you know, yeast in the dough, or whether it's pearls and oysters, and treasure in muddy fields, or even to his own community, a little village, not even on the post, you know, the the map of its day, going home and going, Hey, get used to different this is, this is not what you expect. And if you keep hanging out for what you expect, you're not going to find the treasure. If you keep hanging out for what you expect, you're not going to hear what I want to say to you. And you will end up being on the wrong side of this conversation. Which of course would be the ultimate tragedy to have had the treasure actually in your field. And never to discover, Oh, my goodness. And the challenge.

David Harvey  32:41 
Alright, that's it for now. Thanks so much for listening. We hope you enjoyed this episode from our lunch series on parables. If you want to get in touch with either of us about something we said in the show, you can reach out to us on podcast to text com, or by liking and following to text podcast on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. If you did enjoy what we had to say today, we'd love it if you left a review or a comment where you're listening from and if you really enjoyed it, why don't you share it with a friend. But that is it for now. We're back tomorrow with another parable for all of you. But until then, goodbye